I like to focus on the center of the plane.....where the wing an fuse intersect......leave the ailerons completely alone at first...act like it doesnt even have them....an with the belly of the plane toward you the low wing gets the stick. With practice you wont even think about that but thats a good to get you going at first. Oh an practice practice practice. A good sim would help too.
Torque Rolling??
I know you 3D vets have probably answered this a few times, but I still need the help. I'm ready to torque roll. I'm a solid hoverer. When ever the plane rolls around so the belly is toward me I fall out everytime. Are there any tips on how to react with the belly toward you?
I went all the way around mostly by accident once and realized how cool it looked. I just gotta be able to do that on command.
Thanx, Dick
I went all the way around mostly by accident once and realized how cool it looked. I just gotta be able to do that on command.
Thanx, Dick
1 - 15 of 15 Posts
Man, you can get 100 different ideas, but what hooks said about practice is really it. Burn fuel, fuel, and more fuel. IMO lower is better. If you are a solid hoverer than get it inches off the deck. You'll see it better, and when it gets away it'll just flop on the ground. If you have a good plane it won't hurt it. But if you're 10 feet up and get crossed up, the one time out of 100 that you can't save it even though you're at 10 feet you'll totally screw the pooch, bye bye plane. And if you try to learn at 30 feet, forget it. You just have to see the slightest change in attitude, every little twist.
Also, while sims may help as Hooks said, I think a foamy helps a lot more, at least for me. If you don't have one, get one. The combination of reliable TR and very very strong (and cheap) airframe make for fast learning.
Also, while sims may help as Hooks said, I think a foamy helps a lot more, at least for me. If you don't have one, get one. The combination of reliable TR and very very strong (and cheap) airframe make for fast learning.
I'm really trying to learn this and become competent at this too right now... I have watched others spin my planes like tops, and have even done it myself using a little aileron, or just praying it got all the way around, but I wanted 'real' repeatable, controlled torque rolls (with no aileron Jess 
)
I am getting fairly proficient at them now because I did two of the things Gordo mentioned above
I am doing them 8 ft in front of me 1 ft off the ground
and
I am using a foamy to teach myself
Personally, my biggest reaction is to overreact. I over control it...
Go easy on the sticks- that would be my tip....
)I am getting fairly proficient at them now because I did two of the things Gordo mentioned above
I am doing them 8 ft in front of me 1 ft off the ground
and
I am using a foamy to teach myself
Personally, my biggest reaction is to overreact. I over control it...
Go easy on the sticks- that would be my tip....
RUDDER GOES TOWARD THE LOW WING WHEN IT'S BOTTOM IS SHOWING, That's all you gotta know. practice and lots of it. PS thanks Jeff
I've got the rudder down clean. I lose torques in pitch, somehow.
I got really disciplined this season and really pushed myself. Lots of folks are commenting about how much time I spend in a hover, and how much closer everything is compared to last season.
Keep on the "low wing get's the stick". Left stick that is.
Remember, a small fast correction now, is better then a slow and big one later. That is why hovering close is the key. You see the need for correction much sooner.
Foamys saved me tons of time and money this season. On Sunday, I was hovering with Shane, and we must have plopped in our planes a dozen times each. You just pick it up, check the controls, and give it a toss. I also spend lots of time hovering in my front yard.
Most important, is practice. Frank Knoll Jr said that for $100, he can teach you to hover. He tells you, buy $100 worth of fuel and practice. He is pretty obviously talking about gasoline...
Sims? Well, all I have is a freeware sim (FMS) that is not very realistic. It has a fake Shock Flyer that does OK, however. As a matter of fact, it will not torque at all. But it does give me the opportunity to hover, belly in, and practice the rudder commands to correct it.
I got really disciplined this season and really pushed myself. Lots of folks are commenting about how much time I spend in a hover, and how much closer everything is compared to last season.
Keep on the "low wing get's the stick". Left stick that is.
Remember, a small fast correction now, is better then a slow and big one later. That is why hovering close is the key. You see the need for correction much sooner.
Foamys saved me tons of time and money this season. On Sunday, I was hovering with Shane, and we must have plopped in our planes a dozen times each. You just pick it up, check the controls, and give it a toss. I also spend lots of time hovering in my front yard.
Most important, is practice. Frank Knoll Jr said that for $100, he can teach you to hover. He tells you, buy $100 worth of fuel and practice. He is pretty obviously talking about gasoline...
Sims? Well, all I have is a freeware sim (FMS) that is not very realistic. It has a fake Shock Flyer that does OK, however. As a matter of fact, it will not torque at all. But it does give me the opportunity to hover, belly in, and practice the rudder commands to correct it.
All good advice. A great way to safely practice correct rudder is to come in low, pop up in front of yourself, and then throttle to a slow to moderate climb and rotate the belly torwards you. Try to keep it going straight up, rudder and elevator. Not as easy as you'd think it might be, and will certainly help your belly in hovering & torque roll inputs!
One of the biggest helps for me was learning the characteristics of the plane when it's hovering.
I noticed when I was learning that on a majority of my airplanes they all shared the same characteristics of which way they happen to fall out of a vertical up line. And also how the plane reacts to different throttle transitions.
Once I figured that out it didn't matter what position the airplane was in, I would just give the same rudder, throttle and elevator bumps needed for correction regardless of whether the airplane was top to me, belly to me and side to me.
Any who this has what has worked for me when I first started learning, now it's second nature like anything else.
Most of the time it was down elevator and right rudder corrections. Just a thought!
I noticed when I was learning that on a majority of my airplanes they all shared the same characteristics of which way they happen to fall out of a vertical up line. And also how the plane reacts to different throttle transitions.
Once I figured that out it didn't matter what position the airplane was in, I would just give the same rudder, throttle and elevator bumps needed for correction regardless of whether the airplane was top to me, belly to me and side to me.
Any who this has what has worked for me when I first started learning, now it's second nature like anything else.
Most of the time it was down elevator and right rudder corrections. Just a thought!
Buy a foamie PERIOD! I have watched two of my very good buddies, smallfly, and Jimmy learn this past year to TR Anything. Neither of these two coule do it this time last year. My self is included in this group. Both of them can consistently TR any plane they own now.
A foamie is the best investment ever for learning to fly 3d. Buy one you will not be disappointed.
A foamie is the best investment ever for learning to fly 3d. Buy one you will not be disappointed.
Foamy...fly close...crash <$30 plane replacement costs.
Also, most people practice hovering the plane with the top facing them. Kinda like only making right-handed circles. Quit doing that.... Practice hoving the plane coming towards you. At first, its like learning to hover all over again. Then you just have to put it together.
Also, most people practice hovering the plane with the top facing them. Kinda like only making right-handed circles. Quit doing that.... Practice hoving the plane coming towards you. At first, its like learning to hover all over again. Then you just have to put it together.
Faomy is a great tool to learn with, but also, dont forget the harrier, get use to seeing the belly of the plane when your upright harrier around, that and maybe some sim time.
there ya go, 3 things that will help in no particuliar order
1. sim
2. foamy
3. rightside up harrier
there ya go, 3 things that will help in no particuliar order
1. sim
2. foamy
3. rightside up harrier
When the belly comes at you and a wing dips, point your rudder stick at the low wing. Jeff W.
Another vote for a foamy. They are a little spendy to get started but with as much as you will use them it's worth it. I keep one in my truck and fly at least once a day.
I haven't seen a reply that directly addresses your question about pitch as it concerns the torque roll.
The plane usually won't start to roll when the canopy is towards you unless its pitched onto its back slightly. This means you are facing upwind and the torque effect won't do anything until the wing quits flying.
Once the wheels turn toward you, to recreate the situation, you will usually start giving some down elevator to pitch the nose toward you again. If you hold the nose perfectly straight up it will stop rolling. For a while, your reactions will be slower, and often incorrect, on the rudder with the wheels toward you than with the canopy toward you. This is perfectly natural.
You will notice exactly the same behavior in a good simulator unless you dial the wind down to zero.
If no one else describes this to you in this fashion, it just means that they are already doing it without remembering how they learned it.
Phil
The plane usually won't start to roll when the canopy is towards you unless its pitched onto its back slightly. This means you are facing upwind and the torque effect won't do anything until the wing quits flying.
Once the wheels turn toward you, to recreate the situation, you will usually start giving some down elevator to pitch the nose toward you again. If you hold the nose perfectly straight up it will stop rolling. For a while, your reactions will be slower, and often incorrect, on the rudder with the wheels toward you than with the canopy toward you. This is perfectly natural.
You will notice exactly the same behavior in a good simulator unless you dial the wind down to zero.
If no one else describes this to you in this fashion, it just means that they are already doing it without remembering how they learned it.
Phil
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