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Questions on hovering

5K views 73 replies 20 participants last post by  sparkplug 
#1 ·
I have been practicing a lot learning to hover. I have some that are nice and smooth.The smooth ones take very little corrections. I have a lot more where I am wrestling it around to keep it pointed up. I am getting better though. My question though is when you guys launch from your hand in a hover,do you have the plane trimmed for launching into a hover? I am practicing that with a value hobby foamy. To have a chance to get my other hand on the box quick enough I have to trim the plane for hover. Its working for me but seeing how you guys do it.
 
#2 ·
It's all just in getting lots of practice in and pick a spot to watch the plane. For me when in a hover I watch the tail of the plane for the most part.
 
#3 ·
With your hand on the throttle rudder stick, its not really that important to get to the right stick, if you apply just enough throttle to go upwards your release is the elevator and if it rolls no biggie. The throttle and rudder can do most of the work while getting on the stick
 
#4 ·
Easiest way to learn to hoover is to park your airplane in the wind nose high and then work on keeping it there. If your not comfortable hand launching directly into a hover then fly around and then pull the nose up into a slight breeze and see if that doesn't help.

Do you have anyone to fly around that flies 3D? You can learn more in a hour flying with someone who flies 3D than you can in a year on the internet! :)
 
#9 ·
capthis said:
Prowler said:
Wild Fred said:
trim? what's that?
Something that CJ's claim was outta whack when they crash 8)
Fixed it
Fixed it. :wink:

I really don't remember adding more than one or two clicks of trim to ANY profile plane I've ever built. Or any other plane that I've built. Seriously.

If you want to learn to hover.... Cappy's post above is spot on. :tu: and plan on burning some fuel or electrons. It will take a bit to get good. electric is easier than glow. And a bit of right thrust, one or two degrees, in your engine setup makes it easier also. Yah, some call right thrust cheating. I don't care.
 
#10 ·
capthis said:
Easiest way to learn to hoover is to park your airplane in the wind nose high and then work on keeping it there.
This. A good epp foamy, like the VH or Twisted stuff, is great, but I did find a small balsa profile, with a little more weight --Sabre35 in my case--worked very well in light winds (5-10mph) to harrier into the wind. With that wind, you can hold it stationary in a 45-80 degree nose-up attitude, and learn all the small rudder, aileron, and elevator corrections needed to hover, but if you get in trouble, punch it and the thrust and breeze saves you 90% of the time.

Also, some bad advice I got early was to use LOTS of expo--like 70-80%. That does work for some guys, but I found that it doesn't let you make or see the small corrections needed to hover, and then--BAM--full throw and you're all over the place. Expo is definitely a personal preference, but I've settled around 40-45% on most of my planes...
 
#11 ·
Thanks for the tips.I can fly whole battery packs out harrier into the wind no problem. Where I need more practice with is when there is no wind or light wind and hovering straight up. I am getting better,been practicing a lot. It is just recently I have been trying to hover from launch from hand. I dont use a neckstrap,maybe I need one. But I guess my thumb is not long enough because when I hold the transmitter with one hand,my thumb cannot work the stick. So it seems until I get both hands on the transmitter it is getting out of control. I have adjusted my sticks on the box as short as they go. I am sure I just need more practice.
 
#13 ·
wyo69cowboy said:
capthis said:
Easiest way to learn to hoover is to park your airplane in the wind nose high and then work on keeping it there.
This. A good epp foamy, like the VH or Twisted stuff, is great, but I did find a small balsa profile, with a little more weight --Sabre35 in my case--worked very well in light winds (5-10mph) to harrier into the wind. With that wind, you can hold it stationary in a 45-80 degree nose-up attitude, and learn all the small rudder, aileron, and elevator corrections needed to hover, but if you get in trouble, punch it and the thrust and breeze saves you 90% of the time.

Also, some bad advice I got early was to use LOTS of expo--like 70-80%. That does work for some guys, but I found that it doesn't let you make or see the small corrections needed to hover, and then--BAM--full throw and you're all over the place. Expo is definitely a personal preference, but I've settled around 40-45% on most of my planes...
What he says about expo is the truth. Used to use lots of it until I started flying gliders. One of my DLG's is the same a as a local buddies and I was running his exact program in my taranis but I had added expo just as it's what I did. He flew it a couple times and didn't understand why it flew worse than his. Saw the expo and convinced me to take it out and try the plane again. It's a whole different airplane. Now my 3D planes I haven't been able to get rid of it completely but I have gone from running 45-50% to now being down to 20-25% and I fly better that way.
 
#14 ·
capthis said:
Prowler said:
Wild Fred said:
trim? what's that?
Something that changes every flight when you use corona swervos 8)
Fixed it
oh, so that's why I can't tell the difference! I hold sticks where they need to be since when I started flying, expensive kps-14 mini servos were worse than cheap swervos are now. I guess I could buy 5955's and learn to use trims, but I don't have a nice dryer to store the spare ones on.
 
#15 ·
The only thing expo is good for is turning $100 servos into $5 servos.

BalsaDust said:
wyo69cowboy said:
capthis said:
Easiest way to learn to hoover is to park your airplane in the wind nose high and then work on keeping it there.
This. A good epp foamy, like the VH or Twisted stuff, is great, but I did find a small balsa profile, with a little more weight --Sabre35 in my case--worked very well in light winds (5-10mph) to harrier into the wind. With that wind, you can hold it stationary in a 45-80 degree nose-up attitude, and learn all the small rudder, aileron, and elevator corrections needed to hover, but if you get in trouble, punch it and the thrust and breeze saves you 90% of the time.

Also, some bad advice I got early was to use LOTS of expo--like 70-80%. That does work for some guys, but I found that it doesn't let you make or see the small corrections needed to hover, and then--BAM--full throw and you're all over the place. Expo is definitely a personal preference, but I've settled around 40-45% on most of my planes...
What he says about expo is the truth. Used to use lots of it until I started flying gliders. One of my DLG's is the same a as a local buddies and I was running his exact program in my taranis but I had added expo just as it's what I did. He flew it a couple times and didn't understand why it flew worse than his. Saw the expo and convinced me to take it out and try the plane again. It's a whole different airplane. Now my 3D planes I haven't been able to get rid of it completely but I have gone from running 45-50% to now being down to 20-25% and I fly better that way.
 
#16 ·
Wild Fred said:
capthis said:
Prowler said:
Wild Fred said:
trim? what's that?
Something that changes every flight when you use corona swervos 8)
Fixed it
oh, so that's why I can't tell the difference! I hold sticks where they need to be since when I started flying, expensive kps-14 mini servos were worse than cheap swervos are now. I guess I could buy 5955's and learn to use trims, but I don't have a nice dryer to store the spare ones on.
You sure its a dryer..... I dont think thats big enough :mrgreen:
 
#17 ·
Dr Constrictor said:
The only thing expo is good for is turning $100 servos into $5 servos.

BalsaDust said:
wyo69cowboy said:
capthis said:
Easiest way to learn to hoover is to park your airplane in the wind nose high and then work on keeping it there.
This. A good epp foamy, like the VH or Twisted stuff, is great, but I did find a small balsa profile, with a little more weight --Sabre35 in my case--worked very well in light winds (5-10mph) to harrier into the wind. With that wind, you can hold it stationary in a 45-80 degree nose-up attitude, and learn all the small rudder, aileron, and elevator corrections needed to hover, but if you get in trouble, punch it and the thrust and breeze saves you 90% of the time.

Also, some bad advice I got early was to use LOTS of expo--like 70-80%. That does work for some guys, but I found that it doesn't let you make or see the small corrections needed to hover, and then--BAM--full throw and you're all over the place. Expo is definitely a personal preference, but I've settled around 40-45% on most of my planes...
What he says about expo is the truth. Used to use lots of it until I started flying gliders. One of my DLG's is the same a as a local buddies and I was running his exact program in my taranis but I had added expo just as it's what I did. He flew it a couple times and didn't understand why it flew worse than his. Saw the expo and convinced me to take it out and try the plane again. It's a whole different airplane. Now my 3D planes I haven't been able to get rid of it completely but I have gone from running 45-50% to now being down to 20-25% and I fly better that way.
So buying $6 servos and adding positive expo turns them into $100 servos?
 
#18 ·
Also due to linkage geometry , it take about 40/45% expo to get a perfectly linear throw thought the entire range. This from a hitec employee who had commented on testing he had been involved with an is also where I normally find mine when looking for linear throws.

Not to say that others might find more or less useful to them , but mathematically close to right.
 
#19 ·
capthis said:
Easiest way to learn to hoover is to park your airplane in the wind nose high and then work on keeping it there. If your not comfortable hand launching directly into a hover then fly around and then pull the nose up into a slight breeze and see if that doesn't help.

Do you have anyone to fly around that flies 3D? You can learn more in a hour flying with someone who flies 3D than you can in a year on the internet! :)
That was the answer to your original question. Fly around in an upright harrier a LOT. Soon you will find that the transition from harrier to hovering is easy.. Popping into a hover from an upright harrier is way easier than hovering from a hand launch.

I'm going to see if I have any video of Prowlers 80" LAM Stix from Ottumwa ProBro.. That plane transitions from a harrier to hover so smooth it will blow your mind!

As for the 2nd part of Cappys post, If you can ever make it up to the WI Dells, I'd be glad to fly with you.
 
#20 ·
wyo69cowboy said:
Expo is definitely a personal preference, but I've settled around 40-45% on most of my planes...
dhooks said:
Also due to linkage geometry , it take about 40/45% expo to get a perfectly linear throw thought the entire range.
This is very interesting! I've settled on 25 to 30% as my preference, but seeing wyo69cowboy fly last year was VERY impressive. I will have to try 40%.
 
#21 ·
One other thing that I used to struggle with but goofy kept driving it into my head. Fly in close to yourself and low to the ground. May seem the opposite of what lots of people will saying flying 2 or 3 mistakes high but when your in close you can see the plane better so your quick to make adjustments and when your low to the ground when you do dork the plane usually the only damage will be a broken prop where as if you stuff it in from 15-20 feet in the air there is going to be more damage.
 
#22 ·
Dr Constrictor said:
The only thing expo is good for is turning $100 servos into $5 servos.
]
Well it's a rare occasion, but I agree with Constrictor on this. I have only one airplane that uses any expo. I have about 6 percent mixed into the rudder on my 27% Edge 540. With out the expo on this airplane, it seemed to Fly in a side to side yaw motion like a shark swims.

I think I added about 5% to the plane that my son flies. For somebody that only flies once a year, he is pretty good at flying circles. But the expo smooths him out a bit. I've got him flying a tamed down Primo 40. There is a mix for him, and a mix for me. But, I rarely fly it. It's his plane.
 
#23 ·
BalsaDust said:
One other thing that I used to struggle with but goofy kept driving it into my head. Fly in close to yourself and low to the ground. May seem the opposite of what lots of people will saying flying 2 or 3 mistakes high but when your in close you can see the plane better so your quick to make adjustments and when your low to the ground when you do dork the plane usually the only damage will be a broken prop where as if you stuff it in from 15-20 feet in the air there is going to be more damage.
Finally starting to figure this out. Many of the bros around here have said for a while that it's all about learning how to crash. It has made every part of my flying more smooth especially my landings after I grew some balls by dragging the rudder and elevator alot more.

Everyone else saying to throw plane with right hand, I'm the total opposite. I set throttle with my chin then toss plane with my left hand pulling alot of elevator. And I catch it with my left hand as I flip my throttle cut off with my right. Maybe I'm just weird.
 
#24 ·
Doug B said:
Dr Constrictor said:
The only thing expo is good for is turning $100 servos into $5 servos.
]
Well it's a rare occasion, but I agree with Constrictor on this. I have only one airplane that uses any expo. I have about 6 percent mixed into the rudder on my 27% Edge 540. With out the expo on this airplane, it seemed to Fly in a side to side yaw motion like a shark swims.

I think I added about 5% to the plane that my son flies. For somebody that only flies once a year, he is pretty good at flying circles. But the expo smooths him out a bit. I've got him flying a tamed down Primo 40. There is a mix for him, and a mix for me. But, I rarely fly it. It's his plane.
It's ok, you can both be wrong :lol:
 
#25 ·
I believe that most of our slabs were designed to fly with Expo..

Jeremy Chinn noted numerous times that his Chinn Yak was designed to be flown with Expo on all surfaces.

This is from the Stix 48 Design and Build thread:
TriFlyer3D said:
Flight Testing

Check that all the control surfaces move in the proper direction. Start with 45 deg deflection with 30% expo for the elevator and ailerons and 55 deg on the rudder with 20% expo. These are suggested staring points, experienced flyers may want more than this.
 
#26 ·
gomer said:
Everyone else saying to throw plane with right hand, I'm the total opposite. I set throttle with my chin then toss plane with my left hand pulling alot of elevator. And I catch it with my left hand as I flip my throttle cut off with my right. Maybe I'm just weird.
Pretty much the definition of weird, Bro. :rofl:
Let your freak flag fly! :rockon:
 
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