Ready to try a header run...

Gas and Glow Engine discussion

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:33 pm

PJ my 120 header will be headed your way tomorrow. Hope it helps to have one in front of you to compare to.
President of Chrisy Poos Kit Emoprium "The Leader in Quality Cut Short Kits at Hooks Pricing"

Glitter55, mojo40, Big Tiddy 55cc, VH Giles202. Stashed stix60, stix50, stix46, madyak40

Image
BalsaDust
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 5428
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 12:33 am
Location: Somewhere in the USA

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 10:54 am

Put me in for a 120
sleepin
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 192
Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 3:16 pm

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 12:20 pm

Ok, I have updated the first page regarding the order count however...

***please keep in mind that the 120 header will be more than $40 and I don't know what they will cost yet.***


Just sayin.

:dk: :cash:
Spitfire Mk IIID
2 Sbach 45's
Spaz G202
Wild Tiger
EE 25
Bouncer
Tritle Luscombe Silvair
Primo 15
"...It's always better to regret something you have done than something you haven't.." Butthole Surfers
the lift
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:43 am
Location: Meadville, Pa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 1:54 pm

the lift wrote:***please keep in mind that the 120 header will be more than $40 and I don't know what they will cost yet.***


That's no problem at all! The 120AX with a BCP is such a great combo that the final cost of the header will be worth every penny.
:hover: McDDD #415

˙ʇᴉ op oʇ ʍoɥ ʇno ǝɹnƃᴉɟ ʇ,uɐɔ I ʇnq 'looɔ sʞool ʇxǝʇ spɹɐʍʞɔɐq puɐ uʍop ǝpᴉsd∩
McDDD
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 5646
Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 10:14 pm
Location: Eldon, MO

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:10 am

Are we all in agreement to copy the "long" version of the 120 header? Macs number is 2991.
It is the same as the picture Mo posted on page 2....but at the 13" length.
Spitfire Mk IIID
2 Sbach 45's
Spaz G202
Wild Tiger
EE 25
Bouncer
Tritle Luscombe Silvair
Primo 15
"...It's always better to regret something you have done than something you haven't.." Butthole Surfers
the lift
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:43 am
Location: Meadville, Pa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:16 am

the lift wrote:Are we all in agreement to copy the "long" version of the 120 header? Macs number is 2991.
It is the same as the picture Mo posted on page 2....but at the 13" length.



PJ I talked to mark yesterday. He said he is pretty sure the one I got from him that I sent you to look at is the long one.
President of Chrisy Poos Kit Emoprium "The Leader in Quality Cut Short Kits at Hooks Pricing"

Glitter55, mojo40, Big Tiddy 55cc, VH Giles202. Stashed stix60, stix50, stix46, madyak40

Image
BalsaDust
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 5428
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 12:33 am
Location: Somewhere in the USA

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:54 am

Long version is OK with me.
:hover: McDDD #415

˙ʇᴉ op oʇ ʍoɥ ʇno ǝɹnƃᴉɟ ʇ,uɐɔ I ʇnq 'looɔ sʞool ʇxǝʇ spɹɐʍʞɔɐq puɐ uʍop ǝpᴉsd∩
McDDD
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 5646
Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 10:14 pm
Location: Eldon, MO

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:55 am

BalsaDust wrote:
the lift wrote:Are we all in agreement to copy the "long" version of the 120 header? Macs number is 2991.
It is the same as the picture Mo posted on page 2....but at the 13" length.



PJ I talked to mark yesterday. He said he is pretty sure the one I got from him that I sent you to look at is the long one.


Yes, thank you, i already confirmed that by measuring the sample and comparing to the macs diagram.

I just want to make sure everybody that wants one is in agreement with this 2991 version.
Spitfire Mk IIID
2 Sbach 45's
Spaz G202
Wild Tiger
EE 25
Bouncer
Tritle Luscombe Silvair
Primo 15
"...It's always better to regret something you have done than something you haven't.." Butthole Surfers
the lift
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:43 am
Location: Meadville, Pa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 12:09 pm

the lift wrote:I just want to make sure everybody that wants one is in agreement


Hahahaaaaa. You are very optimistic on this one... just build them to 2991 and they will be happy. :D
Motowncali
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 3502
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 4:17 pm
Location: Napa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 12:12 pm

I just measured mine. From exhaust port face, following the shape of the pipe, my header is 13".

Matt
SOME PEOPLE ARE LIKE SLINKIES - NOT REALLY GOOD FOR ANYTHING BUT THEY BRING A SMILE TO YOUR FACE WHEN PUSHED DOWN THE STAIRS.
basmntdweller
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 6074
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 9:24 pm
Location: USA, Indiana, Indianapolis

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:59 pm

the lift wrote:
BalsaDust wrote:
the lift wrote:Are we all in agreement to copy the "long" version of the 120 header? Macs number is 2991.
It is the same as the picture Mo posted on page 2....but at the 13" length.



PJ I talked to mark yesterday. He said he is pretty sure the one I got from him that I sent you to look at is the long one.


Yes, thank you, i already confirmed that by measuring the sample and comparing to the macs diagram.

I just want to make sure everybody that wants one is in agreement with this 2991 version.


I'm good with whatever. Are you going to need :cash: when?
spaddad
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 396
Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2014 9:25 pm
Location: Ashland OH

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:14 pm

As for money.....let's wait until we get the 120's material list figured out. 72 ÷ 13 leaves 5 units per 6' of tube.

And on the 55's i will figure out the flat rate freight charge for a total when we get the product in hand. I would guess around $7...for both sizes.

Thanks.
Spitfire Mk IIID
2 Sbach 45's
Spaz G202
Wild Tiger
EE 25
Bouncer
Tritle Luscombe Silvair
Primo 15
"...It's always better to regret something you have done than something you haven't.." Butthole Surfers
the lift
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:43 am
Location: Meadville, Pa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:19 am

Hey I just want to touch base with y'all. The guy that said he could bend the pipes "no problem" can't do it now. I have now become "bender." I am in the process of fabbing up a bender for these.

I appreciate your patience.
Attachments
bender-e1432917460469.png
Spitfire Mk IIID
2 Sbach 45's
Spaz G202
Wild Tiger
EE 25
Bouncer
Tritle Luscombe Silvair
Primo 15
"...It's always better to regret something you have done than something you haven't.." Butthole Surfers
the lift
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:43 am
Location: Meadville, Pa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 11:40 am

the lift wrote:Hey I just want to touch base with y'all. The guy that said he could bend the pipes "no problem" can't do it now. I have now become "bender." I am in the process of fabbing up a bender for these.




I see your luck runs about like mine.... :roll:
Anyone got any Cardens for sale???? I need another one!

Crappy Cut Kits your #1 source for kits cut crappily

B&E Graphix-> www.BandEGraphix.com
Planewrappers-> www.planewrappers.com
capthis
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 12327
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 3:11 pm
Location: Evansville IN

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 11:55 am

Ya the first try was with 6061 T6 tube, you can't bend it without annealing it first. He was able to bend it around a wood former but it kinked on the inner radius. Neither of us would care if it was for our own use, but not for selling.

I had some success using a large inner ball bearing race that happens to be the right diameter. This works as a die. Also changed to 5052 tube. But, my rig would put impressions on the outer radius. I am now trying to fab up stuff from my scrap bin at work.

Something like the picture....
Attachments
hqdefault.jpg
hqdefault.jpg (7.18 KiB) Viewed 219 times
Spitfire Mk IIID
2 Sbach 45's
Spaz G202
Wild Tiger
EE 25
Bouncer
Tritle Luscombe Silvair
Primo 15
"...It's always better to regret something you have done than something you haven't.." Butthole Surfers
the lift
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:43 am
Location: Meadville, Pa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 12:15 pm

the lift wrote:Ya the first try was with 6061 T6 tube, you can't bend it without annealing it first. He was able to bend it around a wood former but it kinked on the inner radius. Neither of us would care if it was for our own use, but not for selling.

I had some success using a large inner ball bearing race that happens to be the right diameter. This works as a die. Also changed to 5052 tube. But, my rig would put impressions on the outer radius. I am now trying to fab up stuff from my scrap bin at work.

Something like the picture....


If you have two of the ballbearing races, instead of using something flat on the outside, use another ballbearing race. :drink:
Attachments
IMG_1414.JPG
Motowncali
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 3502
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 4:17 pm
Location: Napa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 1:24 pm

Motowncali wrote:
the lift wrote:Ya the first try was with 6061 T6 tube, you can't bend it without annealing it first. He was able to bend it around a wood former but it kinked on the inner radius. Neither of us would care if it was for our own use, but not for selling.

I had some success using a large inner ball bearing race that happens to be the right diameter. This works as a die. Also changed to 5052 tube. But, my rig would put impressions on the outer radius. I am now trying to fab up stuff from my scrap bin at work.

Something like the picture....


If you have two of the ballbearing races, instead of using something flat on the outside, use another ballbearing race. :drink:



I don't have another race, it was by pure luck that I found the one I am using. I do have another race that is similar but the i.d. is large (like 2+") and needs to be filled to a diameter more suited for a bolt. Had to do the same with the inner die. We have lots of scrap cone bearing parts but not much in ball bearings. It's just a matter of time for me to conjure something up so please be patient with this. I am a bit peeved at this situation.
Spitfire Mk IIID
2 Sbach 45's
Spaz G202
Wild Tiger
EE 25
Bouncer
Tritle Luscombe Silvair
Primo 15
"...It's always better to regret something you have done than something you haven't.." Butthole Surfers
the lift
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:43 am
Location: Meadville, Pa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:39 pm

here is what I have....

Or the $40 harbor crap bender, anyone use one??
Attachments
0313171336.jpg
0313171530a.jpg
0313171530.jpg
Spitfire Mk IIID
2 Sbach 45's
Spaz G202
Wild Tiger
EE 25
Bouncer
Tritle Luscombe Silvair
Primo 15
"...It's always better to regret something you have done than something you haven't.." Butthole Surfers
the lift
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:43 am
Location: Meadville, Pa

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 11:16 am

The bender is the least of your concerns. The alloy and temper of the aluminum will make a much bigger difference in the bend. Look to Ryerson, Reynolds, maybe Bonnel, and others for info on choosing aluminum tubing for applications, manufacturing, etc.
For example, 6061-T6 is not very bend friendly. You've switched to 5005, that should help, don't know. 6061-T6 so strong and hard that if a bar of it is bent, it can be bent back only once and the next time it sees the same stress, it will break every time guaranteed. When bending that tubing the outside would stretch pucker and fail unpredictably, which restricted the bend radius drastically. 6061-T5 can survive somewhat more bending cycles like that before breaking and Temper numbers lower than that are softer yet and can be bent many times before work hardening sets in. If you put a torch to aluminum for a minute and quench it in water it looses all temper and goes to it's raw state, which you will find is a lot like lead. You can bite it and leave teeth marks! You can drill it but it becomes very sticky and will fill the flutes and won't be removed by anything but acid. Big pita to work with in that state. Welding changes temper also and sometimes must be re-tempered but I wouldn't think header pipes will see enough stress to matter. Most alloys will chemically treat to T4 temper and have to be stretched/go into ovens for artificial aging and further hardening. Anyone can buy the chemicals to do chem treatment as well as anodize aluminum at home.

If your 6061 has a T6 temper it may be possible to draw them back with some oven time. Look at the previously mentioned vendor sites, they should have info for doing that or google aluminum tempering/hardening. The vendors also have myriad alloys and tempers and info on their characteristics and which ones are suitable for whatever kind of manipulation.

I've done several jobs that involved forming tight bends in short pieces of tubing and one of the big tricks was to stuff nylon into the tubing, then bend it, then melt the nylon out. This was also done with aluminum inside the tubes then melted out. Perfect bends but forced the outside to stretch more and the inside to compress more.
I've seen a process where polyurethane plugs cast on cables for pulling them into and out of tubes before and after bending would prevent folding on the inside of the bend. Worked great when lubed before hand...
Moe; "Use your brain!"__ Curly; "I'm tryin to think but nuttin happens!"
flailer
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 1683
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 1:22 pm
Location: Kansas City, Missouri

Re: Ready to try a header run...

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:19 pm

Most of the sheet metal we do for work, the aluminum is T0 to begin with, dead soft. After the bending process, some heat treatment and age hardening, then we weld and drill the holes. End up with T6 hardness.

Bending aluminum that is already hardened isn't fun.
Doug B


To those in the military who serve, both past and present, to defend my freedoms, I thank you. I've had a wonderful life so far.
Doug B
Pro Bro
 
User avatar
 
Posts: 5144
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:30 pm
Location: Indianapolis

PreviousNext

Return to Engines

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest